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Post by nanman on May 30, 2008 11:44:46 GMT 3
Dear Subu'atai and Admin
I know whenever we talk about these issues, it is very sensitive.
I wished things were never this way and instead we could have been good neighbours, and distant cousins. It has always hit my mind while staring out towards the South Sea that why have we (Chinese) got ourselves involved in something that really had little to do with and should really never had anything to do with us.
If only some history had taken a different course all of our conversations today with Steppe culture would be how much cross pollination there was between us over the years. And there would not have been much on the issue of occupation.
Anyway, what goes around comes around this could be just another phase in history, its happened before already.
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Post by Nomad (Daz) on Jun 17, 2008 17:43:42 GMT 3
Nanman
I think you should not step back under the pressure of people.
Even if they are such highly ranked people as admin. Shame on them that they allow emotions to come up on such small matter.
What China does is for its nations good. If it was for my nation I would have already occupied West China, South Russia, Uzbekistan and Kyrgystan but saddly we don't have the means for that. Inshalla it will some day happen.
History don't change even if we wish so. (You can rewrite it)
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Post by Subu'atai on Jun 17, 2008 18:07:47 GMT 3
What China does is good? Have you lost your mind? Have you have any idea what they are doing to E.T., Tibet, and Inner-Mongolia? Even flooding their neighbouring countries with as many immigrants as they can. Don't be fooled by the PRC's lies, even their own people are hating the government and you are supporting it as a Kazak?!
Are you still wishing for your own type of modern Imperialism? The world has already learnt internationally from two major world wars and you wish to start another for the sake of Imperialism? If you must fight, fight for independence, preservation of culture and life and against assimilation. Imperialism is history.
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Post by Temüjin on Jun 17, 2008 18:41:50 GMT 3
we don't have the means for that. Inshalla it will some day happen. Chinggis Qa'an didn't had the means, but he did it nevertheless and won. do you think back then the Mongols were in anything superior to the urban neighbours other than in military affairs? it's not that the Steppe is weak, its the urban nations that are now more powerful than back then, but it can be changed by the right tactics and good strategy. |
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Post by Nomad (Daz) on Jun 18, 2008 7:02:37 GMT 3
What world have learned is that nobody will help you in the moment of starvation. If you will not be stronger you will be forced to obey who is stronger. In the age of energy crisis and food shortage. When goverment structure is unstable, revolutions and terrorist attacs are so casual as the bad weather in England. The only way for nation to survive is by doing whatever is necessary.
What China is doing is tring to be stronger so that no other nation will dictate it's will.
Population of China is 1/4 of the world population and with what means do you expect to give the majority what they need for survival? Sacrifices. You will sacrivice your people for the bigger half. You will sacrifice other nation to feed your own, you will sacrifice!
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Post by Nomad (Daz) on Jun 18, 2008 7:19:57 GMT 3
Yes I am Kazakh!
Who doesn't hate its goverment. My goverment made itself a laughing stock. My county is in economical crisis. Whats worse is that people started to starve. Goverment policies only makes the situation to the worse.
Have you seen the goverment where its PM says that everything is good while prices on food, fuel jumps.
Why did I say I want to expand the terretory of Kazakhstan is not under the influence of imperilalizm.
1) Like most of you guys I belive its historicaly kazakhland.
2) Its needed to supply its nation with whats it needs.
3) To increase its population.
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Post by Subu'atai on Jun 18, 2008 16:52:32 GMT 3
I see what you mean. To be honest, I used to be pro-Tibet... but recently changed my point of view. I dont like it when Chinese try to justify their occupation of the steppes. However, there's one justification that I understand - Resistance against Western colonisation. I used to be pro-Tibet until I realised how extensive and false the Western propaganda was. It was clear what they intended to do.
Free Tibet - then they would use it as a colony against China and perhaps the rest of Asia. Since I figured this out - I realised China better stick to its territories until the West backs the f**k off. No more foreign interference, we don't like China occupying the steppes, but if we allow the west to interfere, they would be the ones occupying the steppes.
As for your territorial ambitions, I see your point of view, and in fact, I like it. If you wish to unite the steppes it takes one hell of a leader but expansion these days is not like ancient times. Back in the day great empires were forged when tribes were united either by will or by force. The things we have achieved through unity is unmatched.
However, in modern times - the West WILL get involved, foreigners WILL get involved and use this division and war for unity for their own gain. They will send troops, they will condemn you, they will call for a "crusade", they will NOT let this ritual happen even though this is the way of nomads for thousands upon thousands of years. This is reality - and it's an ugly one.
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Post by nanman on Jun 18, 2008 18:07:57 GMT 3
Basically all kinds of imperialism is unjustifiable whether its Chinese, Western, Russian etc
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Jun 19, 2008 0:07:03 GMT 3
Nanman I think you should not step back under the pressure of people. Even if they are such highly ranked people as admin. Shame on them that they allow emotions to come up on such small matter. What China does is for its nations good. If it was for my nation I would have already occupied West China, South Russia, Uzbekistan and Kyrgystan but saddly we don't have the means for that. Inshalla it will some day happen. History don't change even if we wish so. (You can rewrite it) And shame on you to spread American and Chinese propaganda  |
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Post by Nomad (Daz) on Jun 19, 2008 8:08:29 GMT 3
Well Turkey is also occupying the terretiro and you are proud of it isn't it?
I've been in Greece and they claim and rightfully from historical point of view that West of Turkey (Istanbul) belongs to Greeks.
North-east belongs to Armenians and South to Kurds.
Well lets talk about the occupation of turks in the West. Do you intend to give it back to Greeks or what?
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Post by Verinen Paroni on Jun 19, 2008 10:22:31 GMT 3
Well Turkey is also occupying the terretiro and you are proud of it isn't it? I've been in Greece and they claim and rightfully from historical point of view that West of Turkey (Istanbul) belongs to Greeks. North-east belongs to Armenians and South to Kurds. Well lets talk about the occupation of turks in the West. Do you intend to give it back to Greeks or what? "Nice"... From american and chinese propaganda, you have moved to spread kurdish, armenian and greek propaganda...  What comes next? |
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Post by Nomad (Daz) on Jun 19, 2008 12:17:55 GMT 3
Well if you talk about the propaganda now its Turk Propaganda.
But thats not the core of what I was saying. My point was.... We usually say "You see a chip(nidle) in my eye while you don't see a log in your eye!" I hope you get what I was going to say.
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Jun 19, 2008 13:28:53 GMT 3
If you are going to continue like this, I wil have to remove yo from the forum. This is not a place for you to spread your dirty propaganda and insult our nations!
You manqurt!
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