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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Mar 12, 2009 20:03:03 GMT 3
The relationship between Bulġars and Magyars is very simple: the early Magyars for some time lived next to the Onoġur (Volga Bulġar) branch of the Bulġar Union, and they got their European name via there. Other than that, there is no relationship between two peoples.
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Post by laudatortemporisac on Mar 12, 2009 21:06:05 GMT 3
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Post by Asparuh on Mar 14, 2009 1:43:41 GMT 3
Ok,Thanks Ihsan,Useful information again. So actually the name Hungary comes from Onoghurs ? We say Ungariya in my country. So Ungar-Onoghur look similar,you think,right  I think Bulgaria,Hungary and Romania have a lot of things in common in their tradition and history. If we were one country that would have been great,but unfortunatelly not everybody think like me. Bye. |
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Mar 15, 2009 3:16:15 GMT 3
Indeed, it has been mostly accepted (though some still doubt it) that the European name Hungarian/Ongrie/Ungarn comes from On Oġur  The real name of Hungarians is, as we all know, Magyar. |
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Post by laudatortemporisac on Mar 16, 2009 12:27:47 GMT 3
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Post by realhun on Mar 31, 2009 2:41:48 GMT 3
Hello everyone, I've been enjoying reading some of your very interesting postings. This web site is a testament to what democracy is all about and I'm glad we can all share information, ideas and opinions here! Being of Hungarian/Magyar origin myself and having read lots of info. about World History I firmly believe that for many centuries Hungary's ethnic, cultural, social and military influence came from Turkic and Mongolian people/cultures from the East. From what I've read the Hun, Avar and Magyar people and cultures were ethnically, linguistically, culturally and militarily related. More recent written documents based on more recent extensive archaeological evidence discovered throughout Central, Eastern Europe and Eurasia confirm my belief. It's also now known that Hun and Avar settlements existed much farther Westward into Europe and for a much longer period of time than had previously been thought. If you get the chance, please read a book by an English scholar and archaeologist named Peter Heather, entitled "The Goths". In recent years he traveled with a team of archaeologists throughout Central, Eastern Europe and Eurasia looking for Gothic artifacts. In the process of digging for evidence he discovered two things: The Goths had migrated much farther South and East from their homeland in Sweden and Poland than had previously been believed by Europeans. They reached and eventually settled in an area North of the Black Sea. Also, to his surprise he discovered many Hun and Avar artifacts in a much larger area and from a more extensive period of time than any Europeans had previously thought possible. His team used carbon dating to determine the age of all the artifacts they discovered. Until Peter Heather and his team completed their work and he wrote his book their wasn't nearly as much factual information about the Hun and Avars based on archaeological evidence. In many ways the Hun and the Avars were a mystery to Europeans and nobody knows exactly where they were and what happened to them when their empires weakened. Well......we now know that the Hun, Avar and Magyar people are certainly similar in various ways and related to each other. We also now know contrary to previous European beliefs and teachings that the Hun and Avars didn't just disappear into thin air! The Avars invaded and settled in Europe not long after Attila's empire began to weaken. There were Hun still living there and the Avars quickly united with them because they were of a very similar ethnic, cultural and linguistic background. The same thing happened when the Magyars invaded Europe. They invaded just as the Avar Empire was becoming weak and found that there were still many Avars living in the territory they invaded. Because the Magyars were very similar to the Avars they were quickly able to ally themselves with them. Please read the book by Peter Heather entitled "The Goths". It will provide you with a lot more knowledge about the Hun and Avars. The only reason why the Hungarians call themselves and their language Magyar is because the Magyars were the last of these three tribes to invade Europe and they came in great numbers. However, there are people living in specific regions of Hungary today who insist that they are of Hun or Avar origin and not Magyar. Also, there are many Magyars who insist that they are not Hun nor Avar. Wow!.....This can get so very complicated! Right?! I think overall I'm just a human on this wonderful planet Earth where we all should live in harmony like God wants us to. ;D Best regards to all! The Real Hun - Hajos |
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Post by sarmat on Mar 31, 2009 7:14:29 GMT 3
If you get the chance, please read a book by an English scholar and archaeologist named Peter Heather, entitled "The Goths". In recent years he traveled with a team of archaeologists throughout Central, Eastern Europe and Eurasia looking for Gothic artifacts. In the process of digging for evidence he discovered two things: The Goths had migrated much farther South and East from their homeland in Sweden and Poland than had previously been believed by Europeans. They reached and eventually settled in an area North of the Black Sea. It actually has been discovered a long time ago. We even have a thread about the Gothic Empire of Ermanaric on the Northern Shores of the Black Sea. In fact, Goths lived in Crimea up until the 18th century AD. |
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Post by realhun on Mar 31, 2009 8:03:46 GMT 3
The only point I was trying to convey is that up until about the past 25 years Europeans weren't really certain about the exact migration and final destination of the Goths based on an extensive amount of artifacts discovered from archaeologists' digging for it. However, this wasn't the main emphasis of my posting. I was mainly conveying the fact that within about the past 25 years Peter Heather and his team were digging for Gothic artifacts and instead found a lot more Hun and Avar artifacts including ancient burial sites located all throughout present day Hungary, Eastern half of Austria, Southern/Eastern Germany, Poland, Slovakia, Rumania, Serbia, Croatia and the Ukraine. These findings prove that the Hun and Avars must have had a much more significant and lasting impact on European History and Culture than once believed. |
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Mar 31, 2009 23:14:34 GMT 3
Thank you for the introduction of that book Hajos, I hope one day I can manage to find it However, I still believe that the Hungarian claim on the Huns has more political basis rather than historical. As you said, the Avars came to Eastern Europe only after a short time when the Hunnic Empire dissolved, but we know that the remainder of the Huns integrated into the Oġur tribes and established the Bulġar Union. Even though they might be closely related, the Huns, Oġurs and Avars were still different peoples with different origins (but they were still Turkic nonetheless). The Magyars are another story because they were not even Turkic (though they had Turkic elements among them and as you pointed out before, they were highly influenced by them - even their life style was adopted from them), but Ugric. The number of Huns that joined the Huns, even if they did, which is also debateble, must have been very very low in number, and insignificant to the Magyar population ethnically and culturally. |
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Post by Asparuh on Apr 1, 2009 3:00:17 GMT 3
Hello.
Of course is a pleasure for me to talk about Magyars.
And thank to Ihsan again for mentioning about the Bulgars.
Yes,The Bulgars are something like a indirect descendants of the Huns.before they lived in similar tents,belived in same Pagan god-Tangra,had same shooting excersises with a bow.etc.
If it's true the Magyars were partially influenced from The Onoghurs - Ancient proto-Bulgarian tribe from the Oghuric clan.
If we follow that line,Then the Magyars for me are Finno-Ugrian.
If you look at the Magyar language today you will find a lots of Finnish elements and some turkish words as well.
It was said that the Volga Bulgarians established contacts with Ugrians which for them were the Magyars.They lived further north and west next to the Bulgars.The two nations used to comunicate a lot in the past. I agree that the Magyars adopted the Military skills from the Huns.And yes ! The lands east and west of Pannonia were controlled from The Huns and later from the Avar Khaganate,This is also true.If you look at the National flags of Bulgaria and Hungary today they are almost the same - White,Green and Red.I have been several times in Hungary and i do like this country and the people are very kind as well.Budapest is beautiful !
I think the countries Hungary.Romania and Bulgaria have a lot of things in common related with the Huns.
Ugri or Vengri in Russian is Hungarian.
I know that the Magyars were excelent horseriders.
Very good with the tipycal steppe weapon-the bow.
Also they had Pagan believes.
This is from me for now.
I will write again when i'm more confident about this matter.
Bye !
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Apr 1, 2009 13:11:24 GMT 3
Hi Asparuh I personally think the similar elements between the Hungarians, Romanians and Bulgarians are probably drived more from the later Pecheneks and Cumans, rather than from the earlier Huns |
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Post by Asparuh on Apr 7, 2009 3:41:20 GMT 3
You are quite right actually Ihsan These two nations in particular gaved us a big influence. At it was good ! ;D ,because they were fiereless and brave people.Had excelent horse cavalry and good military skills. |
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Apr 7, 2009 19:46:07 GMT 3
Indeed, they were  And sad thing is that they weakened, defeated and destroyed each other  |
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Post by Asparuh on Apr 15, 2009 2:28:14 GMT 3
Yes,Ihsan,Thei did that yeah.Dissapeared from the face of the history but their remainings were asimilated by the nations of Hungary,Romania and Bulgaria in the Balkan and Pannonia region.I don't know about Ukraine and further east in Asia.Probably the same happened there. I post a new splendid picture of Onoghur influenced Magyars. Bulgars looked extremely similar,because they lived in vecinity of the Magyars. Lovely picture have a look :  |
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Post by H. İhsan Erkoç on Apr 15, 2009 16:48:10 GMT 3
Nice Their clothes are indifferentiable from Turkic nomads. |
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The real name of Hungarians is, as we all know, Magyar.
And sad thing is that they weakened, defeated and destroyed each other 