steppe democracy

[Atabeg]

Just something what I was wondering is democracy working for us. this type of goverment is new to us we never used it before.You have a president, minister,parlement etc.... Thats to much politics what happend to the good old days when people were loyal to their khan and he to the qagan. We were one before nationalism.

btw I think turks don't think democraty works look at one of my idols Mustafa Kemal Atatürk he was a dictator but not an "evil" one he did what he tought was neccesary for his people.
republic of Turkemistan= Turkmenbasy also dictator(somewere I heard he wanted the name ataturkmen but they didn't let him)
Nazabayev is the same(I think he's doing verry well)


so what do you think are the turks& other steppe people democratic(sorry if I didn't include the other steppe peoples countries because I realy don't know what type of goverment they have)

;D

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

Democracy, not Democraty

There are some views in Turkey about how democratic the qaghanate/khanate system was. I somehow disagree with them.

However, in steppe states, the rulers usually cared about the ideas of their ministers and advisors.

[Bor Chono]

U mean Democracy?
Well it seems like it is going well In Mongolia. Also Corruption.

[Atabeg]

yes I mean democracy the T and the Y are next to gether so typo.

Well personaly I think democracy doesn't work. Like you said the qagans listen to there advisors but thats not democracy to much talk and no action.

[Verinen Paroni]

Shortly:

I'm against democracy, because it certainly cannot work well. I prefer authoritanism.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

I would prefer a "rule of the wise men" instead of the "rule of the ignorant masses". Democracy is ok inside the parliamentary/senate/qurultai but the ignorant masses should not be allowed to interfere into the politics.

Democracy is something which has brought Adolf Hitler, Recep Tayyip Erdoðan and the HAMAS to power. This is scary, isn't it?

Note: I am not against personal freedom (to a certain limit, of course) but I would like the well-educated wise professionals to rule a country.

[Atabeg]

admin said:

I would prefer a "rule of the wise men" instead of the "rule of the ignorant masses". Democracy is ok inside the parliamentary/senate/qurultai but the ignorant masses should not be allowed to interfere into the politics.

Democracy is something which has brought Adolf Hitler, Recep Tayyip Erdoðan and the HAMAS to power. This is scary, isn't it?

Note: I am not against personal freedom (to a certain limit, of course) but I would like the well-educated wise professionals to rule a country.

well said

[Nomad (Daz)]

Well if it doesn't work well with us does that mean we should turn back? Does that mean we should creat the group of elders from noble families and trust our lifes to them? Does that mean we should give up on everything we did so far? I think we should keep on going. Everything needs time. Rome was not build in one day. Hopefully it will be done and if not in our lifes maybe our children will live up to it. Democracy should given a second chance and we will adope.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

I don't support a rule of the noble families. I support a rule of technocrats (very well educated wise men who are experts on politics, economics, etc).

[aca]

Everything depends on the moral of our politicians. Democracy or Monarchy, Techocracy or Communism, they all can be successful if their governments are not corrupt.

Well educated people are surely better politicians than not educated ones, but that also mean that they know how to steal better

You can never trust a politician. We have a saying:
"Politika je kurva" - Politics is sleeper*


*OK, this word is censored ;D

[Nomad (Daz)]

Hehehe Agree with Aca. But the morale of truce is that corruption is a powerfull force for all the forms of goverment. You can't survive in politics without corruption. It must be minimalized but kept.

[BAWIR$AQ]

Many of the nomadic confederations and empires were organized as a military democracy.

[Temüjin]

admin said:

I don't support a rule of the noble families. I support a rule of technocrats (very well educated wise men who are experts on politics, economics, etc).

but Nazis for example were technocrats, i think even Bolshewiks can be considdered technocrats. i think technocracy is abd because technocrats will absue their power. i still favour democracy, even though it's not perfect.

BTW, Hitler was not elected legally. Nazis blackmailed democrats to vote for them and they managed to keep communists away from elections. and Hitler was only appointed by President Hindenburg who was mentally ill, in fact he was forced to appoint him. the NSDAP had only 33% of the votes.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

Yes, and the AKP got only 36% or so of the total votes of the 2002 elections, yet they are the only ruling party in Turkey no.

Democracy is something which can allow a small group of people to rise on top if the opposition to this small group is not well-organised.

Democracy is something which brought the Nazis in Germany, HAMAS in Palestine and AKP in Turkey to power. I would no such system.

But anyway, I think we went off-topic PErhaps we should talk about democracy in a different thread. Let us stick to the Steppe Democracy topic

[Nomad (Daz)]

Just as I was planing my trip to China one of the politics(Rahat Aliev) wrote an aticle in a news paper(Karavan) about the monarchy. He is a husband of the first daughter of the President. He talked about how monarchy suited the nomads in privious and that we should not be rushing to the democracy and maybe considering of coming back to the monarchy or something like that. Creating again Zhuzes and dividing each other by tribes. Maybe we should do it. It was well writen and had a good argument for it.