Cedbenjab and the Genocide of the Oirats

[buddharosie]

I've just made my first trip to Mongolia and visited a few out of the way places. One was where monks were executed by ax not only in 1937 but way before in the 18th century when the Manchus were playing one Mongol off the other. I've since learned (and from your website!) that Cebdenjab was the awful culprit. I hear he was a descendant of a brother of Chinghis Khaan but not part of the "Golden Family." What gives that no history book talks about this guy that killed 500,000 to 800,000 men, women and children over the space of 4 years? Was it because Catherine the Great was too busy having a good time and the Manchus didn't want their dirty laundry out for anyone to see?

Sorry to start off with such a heavy question, but I lived 7 years in China and have been all over Manchuria and to have never heard of this guy is a bit shocking. Is this cover up, shame, or cultural imperialism, e.g., things that happen in Central Asia "aren't important"?

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

The Chinese never cared for the things that happened north of the Great Wall, as long as it did not effect them directly.

[buddharosie]

Actually the Chinese did care -- it's only their modern propaganda that wants you to think they didn't. When the Manchus took over in 1644, they created a buffer zone (like the Russians did with the poor Jews in Poland and Ukraine) that originally was off limits to Chinese going north and for keeping the Central Asian peoples from going south. The nomads could party and the farmers could be left alone. It wasn't that bad an arrangement for the first 50 years.

By the 1740s or 100 years after coming to power, the Manchus began to forget their roots. Emperor Qian Long wanted to show he was more Chinese than the Chinese. He began funding the reprinting of all kinds of Chinese texts and the rebuilding of all kinds of Buddhist temples -- and began to play Mongols off one another because if they were fighting each other, they woudn't be encroaching on Manchu/Chinese territory. He also did a lot of back and forth with the Tibetans to keep them off his back. Qian Long's Chinese advisors thought this was great. If the "barbarians" fight each other, they won't bother China. After all, the Manchu emperors had already thrown the Westerners out around 1722 -- again at the advice of their Chinese ministers. If you were lucky enough to do some dirty (excuse me!) "patriotic" work for the Manchus, guess what, you got rewarded with a Chinese title and land!

But really, why is this guy so hidden from history? What made Cebdenjab so powerful that nobody could stand up to him?

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

Hmm I see.

My point was that, if the things happening to the north of the Great Wall did not effect China, the Chinese usually did not care very much, and did not keep detailed records. For example, for the Gök Türk (Tūjué / T'u-chüeh 突厥) Empire, the last ten years of this empire is much lesser known because since they did not launch attacks or interfere into Chinese affairs, the Chinese kept very few and sometimes contradicting records.

[buddharosie]

Yes, I do agree with that

Maybe if the rest of the world keeps bothering them about Chinese Turkestan and Tibet, they may pay attention to that, too. If we do, they will play their "I'm so persecuted" card. We'll just have to put up with the noise I suppose. Silence is not always golden! ;D

[Subu'atai]

2 genocides and we're still alive, they can kiss my dzungar butt