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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 13:09:25 GMT 3
Atabek, please enlighten us about the difference between Anatolian Bağlama (Saz) and Azeri Qopuz. I ask because I really don't know the details, and both look the same. (And cut off that insulting manner of yours against other members of this forum, especially those who are members of the Staff - that is against our rules) First of all, I do not have an insulting manner. Please point it out where you have seen such. About your question, they at least sound different. The detailed difference I do not know.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 16:15:50 GMT 3
Why are they actually called in that way? Karapapak? Because of their Azerbaijani headgear called Papaq, wich distinguished them from local Anatolians. Is there a 0.01% difference between so called Terekemes in Turkey and population of Azerbaijan? They talk like us, dance our dances, play our musics, eat our foods. And they wear our Papaqs. ;D Get real, everyone has ears and eyes. Stop calling something black as white. "Papak" is a headgear common for all the Caucasus. You can't ascribe it only to Azerbaijan. And why are you accusing Atabeg in "inventing" something, when "non-Azeri" theories of Karapapak have been there for more than a hundred years? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KarapapakBTW, in the Soviet census of 1926 Karapaks were listed as a separate ethnicity. They also were deported from Caucasus by Stalin together with Meschetian Turks, unlike Azeris...
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 16:45:37 GMT 3
Sure, but it originally belongs to Azerbaijan. Papaq are a man's honour in Azerbaijan. ;D
You might confuse Karapapak with Karakalpaks in Uzbekistan? What theory? Like said, Karapapak are only name given to Azerbaijani Turks in Turkey because of their headgear.
And this is from your own link:
"Karapapaks speak a dialect of Azeri"
Spare me your theories.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 17:49:26 GMT 3
Please read the link I posted before asking strange questions.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 17:57:53 GMT 3
Asking strange questions? Where did I ask a question?
In your own link it states that Karapapaks speaks a dialect of Azerbaijani Turkish. And they do, its not a secret. ;D
Republic of Azerbaijan mainly consists of 3 tribes. Ayrum, Karapapak and Padar.
While Iranian Azerbaijan consists of Afshar, Karadagh, Shahseven, Khalaj.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 18:18:15 GMT 3
"My own link" also states that there are different theories of origins of Karapaks, including the theory of them being a separate people from Azeris. It's not "my theories" I have not made them up or invented etc.
I just can say, that in my opinion "Karapaks as separate people" make sense because they were singled out and deported, unlike the Azeris who didn't suffer at all from Stalin's deportations.
The link also doesn't say anything about Karakalpaks who live 1000 km away from the region discussed, so it was strange to bring them here from you part.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 18:23:11 GMT 3
Karapapaks speak Azerbaijani Turkish, have same culture and all. How are they a separate people?
If you can point me a difference, then we can talk.
Karapapaks were not deported. Do you have a significant source for it?
Karapapak settlement in Turkey happend during 1800s, they are basically Azerbaijani Turks who fled Russian invasion and was given that name because of their headgear in Turkey.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 18:40:03 GMT 3
Well. I'm not in capacity to make judgment by myself and I'm not pretending to be an expert in this question.
I can only say, that there are academic sources which call Karapapaks a separate (from Azeris) people, while other sources call them a subethnic group of Azeris, etc.
I can only confirm that the sentence above is true and based on factual information that anybody can read and observe. That's it.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 18:41:41 GMT 3
Since you are so good at reading, why don't you understand what I write?
Above all, Karapapaks speaks Azerbaijani Turkish and have same culture as rest of Azerbaijan and everything else same. And this is not a secret.
And again, since you are so good at reading, read this: Basically, Karapapak are a name given to Azerbaijani Turks that fled Russian invasion and settled in Turkey. And why they are called in that way I have already explained.
Do I have to repeat it millions times.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 19:12:42 GMT 3
Anyway, why are we discussing that in this thread? This thread is about Azerbaijani Ashig tradition.
Since you all are staff members, please do not continue a senseless discussion.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 19:50:22 GMT 3
Let us decide by ourselves what discussion to continue and what not...
And save your explanations for something else. Unfortunately, seems that they are convincing enough for you only.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 19:57:29 GMT 3
I don't think going off-topic are what this thread was intended for. But simple to show that original Oghuz traditions still exists among Azerbaijani Turks with purity. And I don't need an Urus to tell me what my people are.
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 20:10:45 GMT 3
Well. If you have problems with Uruses who are trying to explain you something about your people then you have to solve that problem by yourself. Good luck with that! But, that, doesn't relate to the fact, that you failed to prove anything regarding Karapapaks except entertaining the members of this forum with your meaningless repeatitions of the same words again and again without much meaning behind.
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Post by atabek on Jun 7, 2010 20:15:51 GMT 3
So I did not prove anything? You proved it yourself with your link. Karapapaks speak Azerbaijani Turkish, what more do you need?
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Post by sarmat on Jun 7, 2010 20:57:24 GMT 3
Several countries speak English as their official language. Are they all British? The same can be said about French, German, Italian, etc. The article also says that Karapapaks in Anatolia speak Turkish... Does that prove that they are Anatolian Turks in you opinion?
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