Post by hjernespiser on Sept 21, 2012 2:11:18 GMT 3
Is anyone here familiar with the book "Problemy lingvoėtnoistorii tatarskogo naroda" published in Kazan in 1995? Supposedly there's a chapter in it by Professor A. G. Mukhamediev, who specializes in numismatics, about inscriptions on vessels that are written in a script he calls "Turanian". I'm not looking for information from the English translation found on that onlinehome.us website. I'm wondering if anyone is familiar with the actual source and the state of the research amongst experts.
I have an earlier book of his (a not very good photocopy in pdf actually) - "Drevnie Monety Povolzh'ya" (Kazan, 1990). In first chapter he considers Khorezmian coins found in the Volga-Ural region. His notion is that Khorezm is identical with Turan and Kang-yu from the Chinese sources. The "Turanian writings" are actually Khorezmian letters, not Rovas, and he gives them an alternative reading in Turkic. But this book is only about the coins and it doesn't concerns with those vessels. Still, as far as I understood from what was published from his other works on that site (I studied this topic several years ago) they are silver vessels found there that look like Sassanian style which are inscribed with similar writings. He thinks that this Turanian (i.e. Khorezmian) alphabet was the predecessor of the Orhonic runes and actually he uses the similarity of several signs to the runes in his proposed deciphering. Also he gives alternative reading of the seals from the Kubrat's Treasure again with Turanian instead of Greek letters suggesting that Proto-Bulgarians have used a later variant of the same script. The most interesting thing about this for me personally was that in his interpretation those inscriptions seem to be related to Buddhism. But his speculations about the chronology of the Khorezmian kings doesn't seem plausible.
It is mainly about the coins, but I was mistaken - there is also a little chapter about the vessels (p. 27 - 36) I've forgotten about, but still the only writings interpreted in this book are those from the coins. The tables with pictures are between pages 128 and 129 (not very good quality in this edition - otherwise they are the same as in the site: s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/33WritingTuranian/TurPismrEn1-9.htm). It seems in that later article the topic is more elaborated.
Yes, they are very similar. And Khwarezmians have employed Aramaic heterograms just as Persians and Parthians did (at least according to the standard reading). Another problem with those scripts is that most letters look very similar and difficult to discern - thus in Pahlawi the 22 basic signs of Aramaic are eventually reduced to 16 some of which distinguished only by dots above or below (if the scribe hasn't forgotten or thought unduly to put them that is, which they often did). According to Abu Reihan Biruni the Khwarezmians have had extensive literature, but unfortunately it was destroyed by the Muslims and so the reading of the little remaining inscriptions is somehow problematic.
I've came across another interpretation of those same writings on the siver vessels found in Volga-Ural region, only based on Chuvash and related to Zoroastrianism (I just can't find this article now - it was in a Chuvash forum).
Here is another reproduction of some excerpts from Muhamadiev's article: barda-perm.narod.ru/perm/kladi-nadpisi.htm - here the letters can be seen more clearly and there is a table comparing them with the Orhonic runes.
I suppose this is not surprising, given that the official version at least relates the Orhonic runes to Sogdian alphabet which is also very similar and derived from the Aramaic script. It may be a coincidence, but I find resemblance between these letters and some of the Oghuz tamghas as presented by Abulgazi (while those presented by Mahmud Kashgari look more like runes - not Orhonic, but rather those from the Western Steppe:.s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/30_Writing/301Tamgas/AbulgaziOguzTamgas/AbulgaziOguzTamgasEn.htm.
Post by Azadan Januspar on Apr 22, 2020 22:52:36 GMT 3
A great read about Khwarazmians. Thanks! Unfortunately a little is known from the lands beyond Hazarasp. It sounds like the early 8th century expeditions of the Arabs really laid much destruction not only the region but the literary traditions.