Why are the Poles/Lithuanians so nice?

[Subu'atai]

Seriously! It's like of the one of the few things that prevents me from disowning my slavic blood entirely! They are so dam different from the rest of Europe, and sometimes I wish we never attacked them.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

LOL ;D

But keep in mind that the Lithuanians are Baltic, not Slavic

[Verinen Paroni]

Poles have always been between east and west.

I also likes Poles.

Lithuanians are Baltic and many of them are still Shamanistic.

[ALTAR]

I had some sympathy towards Poles, Lithunians because they dont discriminate or try to assimilate Tatars and Qarai Turks. I have also a common point with many of them is anti-russian sentiment (Off Course Its necessary for Estonia and Latvia too)

[Subu'atai]

They are still Shamanistic? I've never heard about that o.O

I had some sympathy towards Poles, Lithunians because they dont discriminate or try to assimilate Tatars and Qarai Turks. I have also a common point with many of them is anti-russian sentiment

Aye, and a people like that I would have been glad to fight for as many Tatars have done in history. I can't say the same for my ancestors in Russia. Does anyone have any links in regards to why Ogedei decided to attack Poland? (Special emphasis on the why) Cause up to Persia and Chingghis Khaan's death the other conquests seem... rather instigated.

To be honest Hungarian and Polish conquests I don't really like in particular. *sighs* If only we had boats could have just sailed around them.

[Temüjin]

Poles are Ok, but nowadays many have that thing going on claiming they had the best cavalry ever and that they were a great military power, for example they try to make the Polish campaign in ww2 look less disastrous than it really was. most of that is exaggeration and ignoring of defeats/weak points.

[Subu'atai]

Aye, attempts of restoration of pride after WW2.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

Nov 23, 2008 17:55:34 GMT 3 Subu'atai said:

Does anyone have any links in regards to why Ogedei decided to attack Poland? (Special emphasis on the why) Cause up to Persia and Chingghis Khaan's death the other conquests seem... rather instigated.

To be honest Hungarian and Polish conquests I don't really like in particular. *sighs* If only we had boats could have just sailed around them.

Poland wasn't the direct target, it was Hungary. After the Mongol victory over the Qïpčaqs in the late 1230s, an important amount of Qïpčaqs fled westwards and took refuge in Hungary. Ögödei Qa'an wanted King Béla IV to become a Mongol vassal and hand over these "rebels", but Béla refused, so he also became a "rebel" in the eyes of the Mongols. After the Mongols finished crushing Russia in 1240, they crossed th Carpathian Mountains and the bigger part of the army entered the Hungarian plains. However, the Mongols knew that a European allied army was bein formed to resist the Mongol invasion, so they decided to hunt down pieces of allied armies before they united. They also wanted to make their army be safer, so they sent a smaller arm to Poland to check for other allied armies that would come to the aid of Hungary.

[Subu'atai]

Ah, it's all piecing together nicely now, thanks

[Temüjin]

afaik they also sent another diversionary force into Transsylvania. what is also interesting is that the Army retreated not directly from europe but south of the Danube through Serbia and Bulgaria.

[H. İhsan Erkoç]

Yes, they probably wanted to be sure if there were no more hostile armies that might cause up some trouble.

[sarmat]

Nov 23, 2008 15:34:44 GMT 3 Subu'atai said:

Seriously! It's like of the one of the few things that prevents me from disowning my slavic blood entirely! They are so dam different from the rest of Europe, and sometimes I wish we never attacked them.

Strange statement

And how are they nicer compare to the rest of Europe with regard to the steppe people?


Moreover, Poles always empasize their "Europeaness" and "the great role" of protecting Europe from "Mongolo-Tataro-Turkish hordes."

Needless to say about the "salvation of Europe" at Vienna.

Polish traditional historical view of steppans was always aka cruel, blood thristy, tricky barbarian. Just watch any Polish historical movie or read a novel. Though, this is very true about the attitude of "Europeans" towards nomades in general.

[Subu'atai]

^

Nov 23, 2008 17:53:04 GMT 3 ALTAR said:

I had some sympathy towards Poles, Lithunians because they dont discriminate or try to assimilate Tatars and Qarai Turks. I have also a common point with many of them is anti-russian sentiment (Off Course Its necessary for Estonia and Latvia too)

There you go

Poles are individuals yes just like everyone else with their own mind, and own set of propagandas to dismiss. Yet they seem to be 'better' individuals I found compared to much of Europe. Not to mention their history and relations with Tatars.

Current Russian politics should reflect this, not post-Orthodox-Byzantine-politics mixed with Western neo-nationalism in response to the collaspe of the USSR. Hell even individual Rus were better people during Soviet times.

[sarmat]

Nov 25, 2008 1:10:37 GMT 3 Subu'atai said:

Current Russian politics should reflect this, not post-Orthodox-Byzantine-politics mixed with Western neo-nationalism in response to the collaspe of the USSR. Hell even individual Rus were better people during Soviet times.

How is Russian politics related here? Unlike during the Soviet times people in Russia have much more opportunity to learn about their Eurasian heritage than during the Soviet times. Even Putin is believed to be somehow influenced by Euroasianism and Gumilev. ;D

"Scrape a Russian and you will find a Tatar"- the saying popular among Poles. ;D

[Subu'atai]

Sure, but they ain't using this opportunity are they? More embarrassing the freaking country. Heh ne ways this thread isn't about Rus bratan.