|  Author | Topic: Hun Language? (Read 4,276 times) |
H. Ihsan Erkoc
Qaghan
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|  | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #30 on Mar 23, 2011, 9:44pm » | |
Raises up even more suspicion.
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Nomad, rider of the ancient east
Nomad, rider that men know the least
Nomad, where you come from no one knows
Nomad, where you go to no one tells
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benzin
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #31 on Mar 24, 2011, 11:21am » | |
There is a way to check if he existed or not, because -according to his necrologue- he published some books, and he was member of the Armenian scientific academy from 1993 until his death. He is doctorate of Yerevan University.
His main books :
- Dynamique évolutionnaire des langues – (Zarytos /Tyros/, 1973)
- Lingua Punica -(Venezia, 1981)
- Les langues scythoides - (Zarytos-Tyros, 1985)
I think these could be checked even if its not easy if there is nothing about them on the net.
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Ardavarz
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #32 on Mar 25, 2011, 1:05am » | |
Yes. I have hoped that some person somewhere could have access to those books and provide some more reliable information. Too bad I don't know French...
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hjernespiser
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benzin
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #34 on Mar 25, 2011, 11:46am » | |
Noone took the time to write an email to the academy of sciences or the university if he existed, everyone just asks it on forums. I think I write a few emails today if I have the time.
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hjernespiser
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #35 on Mar 26, 2011, 10:22am » | |
There's several things from the obit that should be verifiable:
- His birth record
- His death record
- His religious order and ordination
- His presence at some university in Tyros (Tyre) Lebanon
- The "Société de Arménienne Zarytos" organization
- His publications, as noted by benzin
- His honorary membership in Armenian Academy of Sciences
- His honorary degree at University of Yerevan
- The 1992 "Man and Development" conference in Hungary
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benzin
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #36 on Mar 26, 2011, 1:54pm » | |
I had time to make some translation from Astvatzaturian's research.
I skipped the 'bullnuts', and translated the words and the source only. Because its thousands of words, lets start with words starting with letter A.
Signs:
Sources:
Manuscript Library at Tyre (Lybanon): T (Fragments TF, The ten commandments)TT
Société Arménienne de Zarytos: Z („Dlimild Ashar", ZA„ Cosmology"ZK, The ten commandments ZT, Darrhajavaus ZD)
Armenian Church in Kirkuk: K (Fragments)
Surb Khac armenian monostery in Shareza: S (so called. „Guidebook"SG, „Epos"SE, The ten commandments ST)
Sources from Crete: SK (Fragments SKF, „at first there was the Word"SKL )
Concluded word: C
a és még,és pedig (and more, and plus)
TF
aagh ág (bough, limb, side)
ZK, SG
aaghudin ágazni, (to seperate into boughs or to different sides)
ZK
aalta át (across)
SE
aam is, bizony ám, ámpedig (however)
TF, ZA,
adin adni (to give)
TF,ZA,SG
ai és (and)
TF,TD, ZA,ZK, ZT, SG, SE, ST, , SKL
aigh ég (the sky)
ZA, ZK, SG, SE
aishi éspedig (and therefore)
TF, ZA, ZK,,SG,
ajge agy (brain)
ZK, SG
ajgen ajánlani (to recommend)
ZK
ajgin ajánlani (to recommend)
SG
Aji Hold (moon)
TF, ZA
ajs az (that)
TF,ZA,ZK,SG
ajsbit ma (today)
TF
Aldebaran Aldebaran (star)
SG
alje áll (stand)
SG
allin állni vmiből (made of sg.)
SG, SE, ZA, ZK
altybyshum dialektika (knowledge of arguement)
ZK
alu alá (postposition : under sg.)
ZA, ZK, ,SG
alunic alulról (from underneath)
ZK, SG
alunishi alsó, (lower) alunishi red alsó rész (lower part)
1. ZK, SG 2. C
alunwra alúlra, lefelé (to underside)
ZK, SG
aluvatin alávetni magát, aláhelyezni magát (put himself under sg.)
ZA, ZK, ,SG
aluvin alátenni, alávetni (Put sg. under)
ZA, ZK,SG
alutyn alátenni, megtámasztani (v.ö. német unterstützen) (to chock)
alyn alul (down)
ZA, SG
alynelb legalul (most down)
ZA, SG
alynic phejynwra alulról felfelé (from down to up)
ZA, SG
alynwra lefelé (the way down)
ZA, SG
ani lánya vkinek (daughter of someone)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
amena minden (everything)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
amenajic mindennél (than everyting, like more important than everything)
ZA, SG, SE
amenaphejynelb (leges)legfelül (uppermost)
ZK, SG, SE
amenaalynishi legalsó (bottommost)
ZK, SG
amenad…mindenség, mindenek (the whole everything)
ZA, ZK, SG
amendekh mindenek (all of something or all of them)
TF
amendekhnek mindennek, mindeneknek (dativus) (of everything)
TF
amendinek mindenkinek (to everyone)
ZA, SG
amenid minden egyes (each)
ZA, SG
amenidzhi minden egyes (each)
SG, SE
amnig mindig (időhatározó) (always)
SG, SE
amojst amaz ( távolra mutató névmás) (that)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
amyn mindig (időhatározó) (always)
TF, ZA, ZK
Arana Dheneb (csillag) (star)
ZK, SG
ashar világ (world)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
ashkata lánc, szövetség (chain, union)
TD, ZA, SE
ashkataji szövetségi (united, allied)
TF (kizárólag egy helyen!)(only in one source!)
ashkatan szövetségi (allied)
TD(?), ZA, SE
ashkatan birum szövetségi birodalom (allied empire)
ZA, ZK
atha atya, apa (father)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
athalanda haza, pátria, =szóról szóra megfelel a német Vaterland-nak (home, fatherland)
TF
Athaira Altair (csillag) (star)
SG
auha óhaj, kivánalom (wish)
ZT, SG, ST
auharin kívánni, óhajtani (to wish sg.)
ZT, SG, ST
avamaia nagyanya, nagymama (grandmother)
SG
Aveni Vega (csillag) (star)
ZK, SG, SE
azad szabad (free)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
azadatagh szabadító, felszabadító, megszabadító (liberator)
TF
azadatin felszabadítani, megszabadítani (to liberate)
C
az sugár(?)(ray, beam?)
TF
azda sugár (ray, beam)
ZA, ZK, SG
azdin sugározni (beaming)
ZA, ZK
azdigh csillag (star)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
azdighkert csillagkép (szószerint: csillagkert) (star constellation, more precisely : garden of stars)
ZK, SG
azdighum 1.csillaghalmaz, csillagcsoport, galaxis 2. csillagkép: SG (galaxy, group of stars)
ZA, ZK, SG
Azrateni Hamal (csillag) (star)
ZK, SG
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benzin
Tudun
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #37 on Mar 26, 2011, 1:56pm » | |
Just to make clear : first the Hunnic, second the Hungarian and then the (English version)
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Ardavarz
Shad
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #38 on Mar 27, 2011, 1:04am » | |
Thank you very much for this translation!
This way is much easier to use the source without checking every word in online dictionaries which takes enormous quantity of time. We can hope now to advance much faster in studying these texts.
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benzin
Tudun
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #39 on Mar 27, 2011, 4:26pm » | |
Words starting with B
baa 1. nagy emlősállat (big mammal), 2. shuchy baa: szent állat (saint animal)
1.: TF, SG, 2.: ZK, SG
Baajnekheni Regulus (csillag) (a star)
ZK, Sg
Baajnekhvork Algieba (csillag) (a star)
ZK, SG
bana lábszár (shin)
SG
bar: jó. Középfok: barb, felsőfok: barelb. (bar:good, barb:better, barelb:best)
ZA, ZK, SG
bara lándzsa (lance, pike)
SG
Bara(azdighkert) Taurus-Bika (csillagkép,jelentése: Lándzsa) (Taurus constellation, meaning : Pike)
barile jól (módhatározó) (good, like I feel good)
SG
barili jól (módhatározó) (good, like I feel good)
SG
barr szó (word)
ZT, SG
barrild szótár (dictionary)
SG
barum jószág, (régi magyar értelemben vett „barom”.) (domesticated animal, as the old hungarian meaning of:barom)
SG
baryn jól, kiválóan (módhatározó) (good, perfect, as an adverb)
SG
beeh be (határozószóként) (in to: as an adverb, like going into)
SG, SE
beej be (határozószóként) (in to: as an adverb, like going into)
SE
beejvyle belül (határozószó) (inside)
ZA, ZK, SG
beejvyli: belüli (határozóból képzett melléknév) (adjevtive made of the adverb, like the things inside sg.)
SG
beejvyltel belülről (from inside)
ZK
beeka béka (frog)
Beeka (azdighkert) Capricornus – Bak (csillagkép, jelentése: Béka) (Capricornus constellation, meaning:frog)
belee be, befelé (határozószó, felszólításént is) (in, as an imperative, like go inside !)
SG, SE
belewy…belé (határozószó, felszólításként is) (into, as an imperative, like go inside !)
SG, SE
ben vmin belül, magy ban, ben (postposition, inside sg.)
SG, ZA
bein vmin belül lenni (being inside sg.)
ZA, SG
beela belülről mozgató lélek, belsőő üreg, barlang (the soul wich moves us from inside, cave)
SG, SE
beelajic belülről (határozószó) (from inside)
SG, SE
beelic belülről (határozószó) (from inside)
ZA, ZK
bende gyors (fast, quick)
SG, ZK
bendyn gyorsan (faster)
SG, ZK
bery felesleges (unnecessary)
SG, SE
beryjin feleslegesen (unnecessarily)
SG,
berym feleslegesség (superfluity)
SG
beryn felelegesen (határozószó) (unnecessarily)
SG, TT, ZT
Bethelgeuze Betelgeuze (csillag) (a star)
SG
bi nap (idő) (a day)
TF, ZA, ZK, SG, SE
bijuum nappal (daytime)
SG, SE
bima ma (időhatározó szó) (today)
SG, SE
bir szövetség (alliance)
SG, ZA, ZD
birenusin foglalkozni vkivel, vmivel, bekebeleződni vmibe (treating sg or so., annected by, like being part of an alliance)
ZA, SG
birild birtok (land)
SG, SE
birum birodalom (empire)
SG, ZA
bisyn: biztosan, bizonyosan (módhatározó) (for sure, surely)
TF
bite betű (letter, character)
SG
bollob denevér (bat)
SG
Bollob (azdighkert) denevér (Cassiopeia, csillakép) (bat, the cassiopeia constellation)
SG
bor bor (wine)
SG
bortalla bordal (wine song)
TF
buur felület, felszín (bizonyos test felülete, felszíne) (surface of sg.)
TF, ZK
byshen beszélni (to talk)
SG, SE
byshum beszéd (speech)
SG, SE
chun harcos (fighter, warrior)
SG, SE
Chun(azdighkert) Canis Maior (csillakép, jelentése: Harcos, Férfi) (Canis Maior constellation, meaning:warrior man)
SG
chunile hunul (módhatározó) (in Hunnic)
chymin inni (to drink)
TF, ZA, SG, SE
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Ardavarz
Shad
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #40 on Apr 9, 2011, 11:42pm » | |
In Old Bulgarian material was found the calendar term "verenialem" thought to be Hunno-Bulgarian name for "first" (alem) month in the year of Wolf (böri) or in another interpretation Dragon (or rather Lizard - varan).
Here the Hunnic word for "first" is elenishi. There is also elyn meaning "one, alone", which is very close to Bulgarian alem or elem (from another source).
Also "Vereni"(virtually identical with Bulgarian term!) is given as the name of the star Antares (Aplha Scorpionis). In Chinese astronomy Antares (or "Fire Star") is part of a constellation now related to the group of Rabbit but very close to the next belonging to Tiger (= Wolf in Hunno-Bulgarian).
Maybe it's just a coincidence, but it seems interesting...
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benzin
Tudun
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #41 on Apr 11, 2011, 11:10am » | |
The word elem exists in hungarian language as well, it means one piece of something, or one part of something.
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Ardavarz
Shad
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #42 on May 1, 2011, 12:53am » | |
Would somebody tell something about the content of this text:
http://osmagyar.kisbiro.hu/modules.php?n....a-486cbedc7a0b7
It is supposed to be fragments from some Hunnic epic called "Dlimild Ashar" i.e. "Diamond World". It is really difficult for me to decipher it without proper knowledge of Hungarian (I use an automatic translator).
Thanks in advance!
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benzin
Tudun
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #43 on May 1, 2011, 1:19am » | |
Its some kind of poem about an Askatan attack where the two leaders Donud and Cerned starts to invade a swampland and makes the borders of scythia as wide as it has no any gates. the name of the land they starts to invad is Ghereghit.
The second chapter is fully mistycal about the land of Gheregit. Stars became shining 2000 times more than the brightest ones before, light sheeps were rushing through the lands, and light birds were flying everywhere.
The third chapter is about they find a big black mouth in Gheregit where is no god, and its the opponent of the world, nothing shines there. Noone came back from that big black mouth but Donud and Cerned.
Sg. like this
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njohn
Är
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| | Re: Hun Language?
« Reply #44 on Aug 31, 2011, 12:20am » | |
Mar 25, 2011, 10:37am, hjernespiser wrote:
He died 21st May 2008, in TYROS (Lebanon). (Was born in 2nd February 1932, Erzsébetváros, ERDÉLY, HUNGARY-Transilvany).
He worked at Armenian University of Tyros.
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